First Time Hunting

OK
I have carried firearms for 30 years, but have never been hunting.  I decided to get my “hunting license” and now need to get a fire-stick to go after them there critters.  I applied for a deer tag and I live in Arizona, so I am thinking I need something that can reach out a long way, but will not send my shoulder to Mexico.  I understand 30-30, 30-06, and 308 are some of the best options, but I do not know why or even if that is true.
Will any of you enlightened individuals care to pass on some wisdom???
What is a good round and what do you think are the best fire-sticks????

Well, that's an interesting question. A new deer hunter without pre-conceived notions of best rifle and caliber....dang.

For Arizona, I'm guessing you'll have some long distance shots. I'd start with a bolt action and a good scope. The number of caliber options is huge. I'd look at something that's easy to get at your local store. In my neck of the woods, I can always find 30-06, 308, 7mm Mag and 243.

If it was me, and if I was starting with a clean slate, I'd probably start with a solid bolt action synthetic stock rifle in 308. Will certainly be large enough for deer, but won't knock your shoulder out of the socket. Ammo availability is likely to be as good as anything else. I'd probably start by taking a look at that new Ruger American. I'd also see what Remington has to offer.

Out in AZ I understand what you hunt is not white tail but couse deer. They are smaller, and you rarely get much closer that 200+ yds. That said, a .30-30 will not get it - too far. Especially as you will have 300 yd shots often enough.

.308 will go there, .30-'06 will go there, 7mm mag will go there, and you failed to mention my favorite - .300 WinMag. But since you will be shooting at longer ranges, you will probably find a heavier bullet works better as it has less wind drift. .30-'06 tends to shoot better with the 180gr stuff than .308, 7mm Mag has a rather limited weight selection. .300 WinMag will shoot just about anything.

As for a particular brand of rifle, there are a bunch out there. BUT I would shoot them first before plunking down cash. My personal experience, FWIW, is that the easiest shooting rifle is a Winchester Model 70. My .300 WinMag Model 70 kicks less than a .30-'06 Remington 700 did. Granted the Remmie didn't have a recoil pad on it, but that's part of what you get. YPYMYTYC.

How about the .270 Win or the .270 WSM? They're flat shooting speedsters with a ballistically efficient projectile. I can't imagine you'll need a lot of bullet for scrub deer.  Or, (and I'm sure you saw this coming Dev), you could use the same projectile in the 6.8 Rem SPC, in a bolt or an AR (my current choice.) However, with the AR platform, you are mostly limited to no more than 130 gr bullets.  

I've long admired (from afar) the old school cool .25-06. There's also the .243 which can be used in short actions. Both can double as varmint cartridges. Then, there's the parent case for the .243, the do-everything .308 to consider.  

For the bang-stick? If I wasn't going to stay with the AR platform, I'd personally go with the Rem 700 with a synthetic stock as a hunting rifle, Shot 'em - liked 'em. They're robust, accurate, available, relatively reasonably priced, and well supported with accessories. However, Winchester, Savage and Ruger are also excellent choices. You get the fun of picking!

Thanks for letting us spend your money, ACM. Please let us know your selection and the results of your hunts. Best o' Luck!

This is a bit of a heretical answer, what about not getting a rifle initially? Friends who hunt nearly always have a spare rifle and there is likely more benefit with learning to scout an area, spotting some deer and watching their movements without a rifle initially.

This is a good podcast I listened to a while ago:
huntgathergroweat.com/episode-35-scouting-the-deer-woods

and this is an Australian equivalent:
australianhuntingpodcast.com.au/ahp-26-hunting-deer-with-ada-victorian-president-steve-garlick/

Not knowing the deer or environment I wouldn't suggest much other than echo the idea of a standard calibre - 243, 308, 30-06. An initially maybe a lower priced rifle like one of the Ruger Americans, Marlin X7 , stevens etc. I am always wary of pushing people in a new hobby to spend up big and a Win M70 in 300 Win Mag is not going to be cheap to purchase or feed.
Don't forget about the crufflers - a Mosin has plenty of downsides but they just work, the action is actually really nice and generally smooth (trigger heavy) but will roll a deer. Another podcast here about a newby hunting with the Mosin:

saveourskills.com/episdoe-30-hunting-deer-view-point-absolute-beginner

sthwestvictoria wrote:what about not getting a rifle initially?  Friends who hunt nearly always have a spare rifle and there is likely more benefit with learning to scout an area, spotting some deer and watching their movements without a rifle initially.

Hello All and thank you so much for all the great information.
I took your advice and spoke with the guy taking me hunting.  His name is named Jim Lazzeroni and his family has been building rifles for many years.  He is a big time hunter and when I asked him the same questions I asked you guys, he gave very similar answer and he offered up his Lazzeroni 284 Firebird for me to use.   I have known Jim for years and knew about the family business, but I had no Idea the cost of these things.  Wow,   ………. Is all I can say.  I will let you know how it goes and what I get in the end.

I can hear the conversations now:

"Just went deer hunting for the first time."

"Really, what rifle did you use?"

"A Lazzeroni 284 Firebird."

(Silence...crickets chirp in the background...the other guy stares and blinks a couple of times...)

.
In the 40 gigawatt range?

[Edit:] Holy shrinkies, there is such a rifle! h t t p : / / w w w.lazzeroni.com/ct_rifles.htm The prices start at eye-watering and go all the way to chest-clutching. Cool!

I almost think you guys do not believe me. I told you the rifle was Expensive!!! I will have to get a picture so you will believe....  
  

AChristianMarksman wrote:I almost think you guys do not believe me.  I told you the rifle was Expensive!!!  I will have to get a picture so you will believe....  
  

LOL. But you've gotta admit Lazzeroni (Italian sharks with frikin' laser beams), combined with 284 Firebird (Smokey and the Bandit), does kinda trip the BS filters. Heck, I can feel something pulling my leg right now... And you guys in 'zona already have a leg up on us - not having to deal with that dang Daylight Savings time change. Forgive me.  

"The fastest 7mm cartridge made."  Cool beans.

Not only no Daylight Savings time, we also have (dare I say it) Constitutional Carry….

I did not know that the Lazzeroni Rifle was NOT well know, or that it was so out of this world expensive compared to other rifles. Live and learn...... I will still get a Picture of me with it to post, and hopefully a big ol deer next to me.... (OK, this is Southern Zona, so the deer will not all that big)...

AChristianMarksman wrote:Not only no Daylight Savings time, we also have (dare I say it)  Constitutional Carry….

I did not know that the Lazzeroni Rifle was NOT well know, or that it was so out of this world expensive compared to other rifles.  Live and learn......  I will still get a Picture of me with it to post, and hopefully a big ol deer next to me....  (OK, this is Southern Zona, so the deer will not all that big)...

I only know of it as an African Safari rifle. There is a particular cartridge that Lazzaroni developed, based, if I'm not mistaken, on the .458. The .458 has a terrible reputation in Africa as it is really short-ranged and doesn't stop BIG critters all that well. Lazzaroni fixed that - kind of by making it a SUPER .458 IIRC.

You know the guy, enjoy the rifle. It is in the realm of the custom shotguns in cost.

sthwestvictoria wrote:This is a bit of a heretical answer, what about not getting a rifle initially?  Friends who hunt nearly always have a spare rifle and there is likely more benefit with learning to scout an area, spotting some deer and watching their movements without a rifle initially.

Good advice. I had a cousin who went elk hunting and had a great experience. I let him borrow my .308 bolt gun, and he came home with an elk. Due to all the work and cost involved after taking the animal, he decided that elk hunting was a fun thing to do once, but not repeat often (at least for him). Now he has a nice trophy, but didn't have to spend money on unnecessary equipment.

Corn! Weapons "unnecessary equipment". I'm devastated.

Devereaux wrote:Corn! Weapons "unnecessary equipment". I'm devastated.

Ha ha... I will always look for a good excuse to buy more "unnecessary equipment."

OK...It was not my intent but I lied.
Jim is not letting me use his Rifle

He is letting me use his wife's.

AChristianMarksman wrote:He is letting me use his wife's.

Wow, he's putting his life in your hands.    

I lent my wife's Vaqueros to a friend wanting to try SASS.  Well... we came home with one of her guns in a bag: the screw holding the ejector rod housing had fallen out and was lost. She was not best pleased. Incensed even. Fortunately, Ruger's excellent Customer Service came through and I had a replacement screw in three days. Just in time; one can only endure so much German Stink-eye.

Well, I have pictures of the rifle I thought I was going to use and the one my friend is going to let me use but it seems I can not post them. Does anyone know of a hosting place I can link to so I can post them???

AChristianMarksman wrote:Well, I have pictures of the rifle I thought I was going to use and the one my friend is going to let me use but it seems I can not post them.  Does anyone know of a hosting place I can link to so I can post them???

I use http://tinypic.com/ it seems to work well on all sorts of different forums.

Thank you very very much sthwestvictoria

Here is the rifle I thought I was going to use


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The one I will be using.

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Well, that did not work very well. Lets try that again.

OK. Preview looks great but...... Maybe they are to big.

ACM, if the file is already on the webz, try using the "Insert an Image" button above the Reply box. It looks like a TV set with the dial on the right.  To the immediate left of it is a "Host an Image" button. I've used the "Host an Image", it's little wonky, but it can be persuaded to work.

Let's see:



That's copying a file on my 'puter and Hosting through the button. Had to manually copy and paste the Image link.


For online image hosting, I like Picasa, Flickr.com, photobucket.com, or my favorite smugmug.com (paid).